People should have to defend their views with reasons at every turn since they know they are capable of error. They cease to have it if they cannot. They should welcome criticisms of it that are based on reason. People should consider it their duty as long as they have personal freedom to defend their views with reason and attack contradicting views with reason.

Pro-Choice Advocate D:

See, that's the problem here. There isn't always a "wrong" in every debate. There's inevitably a "wrong to YOU" but it's not universally evil. Murder is wrong, rape is wrong, anything that hurts someone else is wrong, and before you say it NO I still do not see unborn fetuses as alive so don't even mention it.

Nate:

I can't say I disagree with their not being a wrong in every debate. I guess if we had a debate about which side of the street is better to drive on, I couldn't say either was more right than the other. Here, I'll actually use the topic's name in this response...so, you think it's okay to have an abortion because you do not *see* unborn fetuses as *alive*? Does that mean they're not alive? Does it matter if they are "alive" by the dictionary definition?

Pro-Choice Advocate D:

Either way, it doesn't affect YOU or anybody else who's in a position to be inured by it.

Nate:

So, in other words, I shouldn't care about others. If people are killing each other in the next state, who cares unless I go there? I shouldn't care that they kill the guiltless and those that intend no harm?

Pro-Choice Advocate D:

Again you're making the point "abortion is murder" which I don't abide by, try again.

Nate:

Hmm, if you try to point out the ways it's different, I think I can show that those differences are not vital to your belief that murder is wrong.

Pro-Choice Advocate D:

I've said how it's different over and over, if you didn't pay attention tough.

Nate:

These are quotes by you I found and my answers to them.

"Unborn fetuses are not "people" per-se, any more than a womans unfertilized eggs are"

This can't be right. Otherwise, how do fetuses become babies when unfertilized eggs don't?

"Well wanna ask the fetus if it wants to be born? Oh yeah, that's right, it doesn't have a brain yet."

No brain? That would be because it's perfectly normal not to have a brain at that point. (It has been brought to my attention that at the fetal stage of development of an unborn child, a brain has formed. I mistakenly reponded to what I thought this person meant to say instead of what the person actually said.)

"something that doesn't exist yet"

Fetuses do exist. I'd hate to think of our mental state if we discussed how to treat what does not exist...

"Okay, when it can live and breathe of its own devices outside of the womb."

So location determines whether you have the right to live? I find that rather arbitrary. This reminds me of someone who loves all animals equally saying it's wrong to shoot a moose cuz you killed it, but it's okay to take a fish out of water since it just dies on its own.

"Pro-Choice Advocate D: Why should the sins of the rapist be held against his victim? That's what you're doing by making the mother go against her wishes, saying "You got raped, YOU accept the consequences." "why should an innocent woman be "sentenced""

Is she really innocent? She's relatively innocent, but not as innocent as the fetus. She certainly isn't even relatively innocent anymore if she aborts it...

"Do you think anyone who takes a life under any circumstances at all should go to prison? It's a valid argument and applies to this discussion as well."

Someone who purposely takes the life of one who is innocent and intends no harm should go to jail.

"Oppression of who exactly? People of all races and walks of life have abortions, we're hardly only aborting black or Hispanic babies here."

...people of all races and of the first "walk" of life

"You don't miss what you never had"

So murder is just wrong because it takes away what one has previously experienced? Now, how can you take away something that is in the past? I went to church yesterday. Let's assume it was the most awesome church service ever. That experience is gone whether you murder me now or I live to be 100. Instead, I don't want anyone to murder me because next week's service might be awesome again.

"then why he hell does it TAKE nine-months for a child to be born?"

Why does it take 15-20 years to have an adult-sized body? That's how human beings grow.

"Yeah, so what stop that from applying here?"

The fact that there is no significant difference between the fetus and the "person" that I think it is wrong to murder, and if I didn't think that to think otherwise was contradictory, I wouldn't be discussing it.