I point out babies are not all perfect and precious as some would believe. Some are downright @#$%^, @#$%^&*@, manipulators, and criminals. How do you know it's not little Al-Capone being aborted? Saves us a lot of trouble later.

Nate:

The innocent until proven guilty principle voices the opposite view, that it is worse to punish the innocent than to let the guilty go free. Augustine seems to agree, citing this as part of the need for divine law, because human law, in trying to eliminate evils, may also do away with many good things. Then the common good of human society may be adversely affected. Divine law is law that exists to punish all true evils. Who's to say what the true evils are? No one has to say them. They will punish themselves in time. The divine law picks up where human law leaves off.

Pro-Choice Advocate D:

If divine law will take care of everyone who aborts, what's the point of making it illegal in human law? What's the point of making ANYTHING illegal? If you do something "evil" like murder or rape, you'll get what's coming to you. Mmhmm.

Nate:

To prevent people from harming themselves and others with their evil ways.

Pro-Choice Advocate D:

How do YOU decide what's good" and "evil"?

Nate:

I don't make laws. Laws should be made for the good of the people, that good being what the lawmaker has determined to be good by using reason.

Pro-Choice Advocate D:

And the lawmaker at this point deems abortion legal and, by your definition, "good". That isn't enough for you?

Nate:

Abortion was deemed legal, but whether it was deemed legal (and good) by using reason is what is being debated. My position is that it was not.